Goldstein & Bent DEBATE if Man City's owners should be FORCED to sell after STATE OF THE GAME report

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Goldstein & Bent debate whether Man City's owners should be forced to sell after State of the Game report

talkSPORT discusses the Independent Football Regulator's State of the Game report, including widespread losses despite huge revenue, the regulator's power to force owner sales, and rising costs for fans. The conclusion is that many clubs are financially unsustainable, the regulator can act once appeals finish, and the hosts disagree over whether Man City is a financial-risk example.

Andy Goldstein and Darren Bent discuss the 'STATE OF THE GAME' report published by IFR. Subscribe: https://youtube.com/c/talkSPORT 🏆 Ready to win? Check out the latest prizes at talkSPORTwin.com Enjoyed this YouTube video? 😍 🖥️ talkSPORT's Website: https://talksport.com/ 📲 talkSPORT's Twitter: https://twitter.com/talkSPORT 📷 talkSPORT's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/talksport/?hl=en 👤 talkSPORT's Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/talkSPORT/ 📱 talkSPORT's Tik Tok: https://www.tiktok.com/@talksport ? 🔴 Download the talkSPORT app HERE! - https://talksport.com/apps/ 🔎 Want to see if you feature on our YouTube channel? Check out our Best talkSPORT callers playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFVMnSsi04LGLa9pS9xDvme-Gjmlu2 talksport manchestercity premierleague

Transcript

Right, a little bit of breaking news here on Talk Sports Promise. The independent football regulator has published the draft of its state of the game report. This is very important by the way you lot. The report takes a deep dive into the finances in English football and the health of the pyramid as a whole. Talk Sports senior football correspondent Ben Jacobs can explain everything. The state of the game report is 270 pages and it took 11 months to produce and it highlights a game loaded with both revenue but also risk. Professional clubs brought in9 billion pounds in 2025 26 alone and Premier League clubs since 1992 have actually grown on average 10 times faster than the UK economy. And yet at the other extreme, 94% of clubs are currently making losses. 32 teams could not survive 30 days without owner funding. 60% of EFL and National League clubs are technically insolvent. And that also applies to 20% of Premier League clubs. The solution focuses on revenue distribution. and the independent football regulator are confident that the Premier League and DFL will agree a funding deal in the coming days or weeks and they have been involved in that particular negotiation. The independent football regulator has also outlined plans to address financial losses, look into a national league specific strategy and tackle financial and corporate governance. Its first task though might be to intervene in Manchester City's future if the club fails in its appeal to overturn an almost entirely guilty verdict on its Premier League charges. The independent football regulator at one extreme use of its powers even has the ability to force Shape Mansour to sell. But they won't get involved until all aspects including any appeals have run their full course. Now, as you would imagine, there's a lot to take in there, Benny. Just in a nutshell, what's he talking about? >> If clubs don't start to um take care, then they're going to go under. >> I think in a nutshell, that is it, actually. Um, in fact, following the publication of the report, Ben Jacobs sat down with the chair of the independent football regulator, David Kugan, and asked Ben if the so-called big six are good or bad for the English game. within the Premier League for the the higher up you go in the Premier League for those clubs, most of those clubs are only only getting 50% of their money from Premier League media money. The rest is from commercial revenue and from gate money. So, the gap between the big six is growing and growing and growing. It's growing because they're in Europe. It's growing because of their commercial revenue. is growing because they're spending money on stadia and getting more and more ticket um values coming through which means that the clubs lower down the Premier League are having to compete more and more and it also means that the risks that are growing within the Premier League of precipaces within it are growing as well. Now how do we address that? We partially address that by good financial regulation. We partially address that by the way in which we look at how clubs are being relegated from the Premier League into the Championships through parachute payments are being uh affected and we partially look at how clubs going into the Premier League are protected by monies when they go up. >> I know you have to let the process run its course regarding Manchester City's guilty charges and subsequent appeal, but what is in your powers? Can the independent football regulator look at owners and directors and even if applicable force a potential sale of the football club? >> Our powers are about owners, directors and senior executives. Uh we have the power to investigate. We have the power to make decisions as to whether owners, directors, and senior executives have been acting appropriately. And we have the power to act against those individuals if we um have the evidence to do so. So far we've been going for 16 months. We have not had to actually undertake those powers. Uh but our powers are very clear in the legislation and they will be available if we need them. >> That was the chair the independent football regulator David Kugan speaking of Ben Jacobs following the release of the draft state of the game report which has just been published. Now if you're a bit like me and Benty and a lot of football fans, you hear lots of words and you go sorry I don't I don't really understand what said lots of words. I got a bit of a headache. Goldstein just in a nutshell what's going on. So this is the first time ever that the government have got an independent regulator, football regulator to have a look at the finances of our game. They're not connected to the Premier League. They're not connected to their but it's just an independent body if you like that outsourced. >> Yeah. And they've looked at all the money coming and going just just to find out where we are with the state of the game and sustainable >> and whether or not that's a very key word there. So let me give you some of the headlines, right? And some of them they make for very interesting and I think quite frightening reading actually. So the big headline out of all of that is English football brings in over 9 billion pounds right >> just we know that right with TV revenue etc. >> But 94% of the top 116 men's English football clubs are still operating at a loss. Now I find that absolutely staggering. There's 9 billion effectively 9 billion coming into the game >> and for 94% of the clubs it's not enough they are losing money. Uh it goes on to tell us that more than a quarter of the clubs would be unavailable to site to survive more than 30 days if their owners pulled funding. >> Yeah, that that I can understand. >> I mean >> that that bit makes sense to me that that's just not >> they can't last more than a month unless their owners keep putting money into the fun. >> Of course. I mean, you got you take you take some of the top clubs like you just we use City in this example or even Man United. >> Yeah, I wouldn't use City as the example probably. There's ones you shouldn't use. >> Yeah, let's go Man United, right? >> You're playing Rashford or 300. Like you've got so many players that are probably 250 above. Of course, if they will suddenly just stop the money and of cost obviously cost of >> No, no, not the money coming into the club. The money the owners are putting in to the club. >> Yeah. If they suddenly stopped it like >> but you you you would think that the money that's in the game would be enough to fund the clubs. Also, how how do you keep a stadium going, training? There's so many costs when when it comes to football. >> I know, but you think if 9 billion's coming in, that they shouldn't be operating at a minus. It should be a positive. >> Well, that's not 9 billion per club. >> No, that's what I'm saying. So, like I split it, it makes it makes sense to me that like the running cost of Old Trafford, the players, the training ground. >> There's no way any club should be allowed to to run. should. But my point is I can see why if they stopped it be >> Do you want to finish that cuz you went it would be you didn't put any other words on the end of that sentence. Parachute you right? Yeah. Parachute payments for getting uh re relegated from the Premier League encourages Championship sides to overspend. I mean that that is frightening. So they get relegated. They get what is it about 33 million a year they're getting parachute payments. I think I think it's around about that. And because a club that's gone into the Championship knows that for the next three years they're getting money from the Premier League, that encourages them to spend more money than they're making as a club, as a company. >> Yeah. Yeah. Because it gives them more opportunities to go up. >> I know. But they're overspending. >> They are, but they're hoping that by the time Yeah. >> And we saw what happened to Leeds, right? They spent all that money back in the day. They got to Champions League semi-finals and it cost them too much money. The regulator has the power, this is key, to assess the sustainability of owners and executives and can force them to sell clubs if they see fit. Now, this is what they've been talking about with regards to Man City. >> If they think for whatever reason the owners aren't fit and proper to run a club out, they've got that power. >> This they've got the power, but this is the problem I've got is that >> lot Abramovic, right? >> Yeah. But my problem, my point is for that Man City and it's it's awful. But when you talk about the the uh the AFR regulators, right, >> the one thing about City though, the problem is not money. >> Obviously, money keeps football clubs >> going, right? That's that's the only thing that keeps them going, right? >> Yeah. >> That's one thing Man City don't have a problem with. >> So, unless the cheat the cheating part, >> the Man City do have a problem with it. >> Well, the cheating part is where the regulator might go, "Nope, you're not fit. You've broke the rules." And then you go, but in terms of keeping a club running with the money that they've got, it's endless. So, that's not their problem. Well, no, no, it is because it's all to do with income. >> Yeah. My point is if they've got whatever level they've got to drop down to city, they've got the funds there that the Man City as long as them owners are in charge will never go bust. >> That's right. That's right. But they but yeah, you've chosen Man City probably the wrong team. >> No, I'm just giving a club with endless amount of money. >> All right. Okay. Yeah. To fund it, but not necessarily to pay wages. You can't You can pump money into a club. Spurs recently put about 150 million in. That's enough to to run the club, but it's not enough for transfers and you're not allowed to use it for transfers and for players wages. Uh the last one is the Premier League recently offered the EFL 180 million a year in funding for 10 years. The EFL pushing for 207 million a year. I'm guessing they'll meet somewhere in between. >> 180 million don't sound a lot for the EFL. >> No, >> doesn't sound a lot, does it? >> No, it's added on money. >> Yeah, >> that's per year. I mean it's I mean I' I've heard mixed reports. Some people say they like this reg independent regulator. Some people said they don't like it. Um but the most important thing is that football clubs are run properly and don't go out of business. >> But 94% is what is a >> That's my first question. How worrying is it that 94% of clubs are operating at a loss. I find that absolutely staggering. Even if that was 20%. I'd find that mind-blowing. >> What about but Man United the Glazers? >> Yeah. Well, they moved the debt from another club on to Man United the day they bought. How have they got away with that? >> You're asking the wrong question cuz what I mean Man United fans lose a plot with this cuz every single season they add to the debt. >> Yes. Because the for two reasons. One, they're spending money and also the interest on the debt that they owe is >> but they're taking big chunks out for themselves, aren't they? Every year. >> Yes. They take dividends out. >> How is that see that there? How is that possible? >> That's that's >> I can't answer. I don't I get that idea. But that's why Man United fans who who understand it probably better than we do lose the plot. And >> yeah, I mean, you're going down a completely different road, but one that needs to be looked at. How on earth can someone own like an NFL club or whatever and then have a debt on that and then buy Man United and just move the debt over? I just >> I mean, yeah, that's a conversation for another day. Um, let me ask you this. So, I want to get football fans cuz it it sounds quite complicated and if you listen to this, you think I still don't get it. Ultimately, ultimately for me, it feels like football is moving further and further away from the everyday fan. Yeah, of course. >> Because if you're if you're operating at a loss and you're one of 94% of English clubs operating at a loss, that means those clubs >> that are losing money are going to have to keep pushing up their prices. And I'm not just talking about season tickets and seats. I'm talking about match day programs, shirt sales, beers, pies, burgers, everything about the match day experience has to go up and it will keep going up now. And I think the more I mean my dad, God bless him, years and years ago when we went into the Premier League and the amount of money you were talking about when there was like every single transfer window it seemed like there was a British transfer record that was broken >> would say like it's not for the everyday man now. The everyday man can't afford it >> and I was like nah don't be silly. I'm I'm starting to think that's a problem. >> No, 100%. If if you go for a proper match day with your family, say you got two two kids, you take the two kids there, it's just you and the two kids. You got to buy programs. The food's expensive now. The travel's expensive. You go to the club shop, like football kits nowadays are ridiculous. >> You're not getting change for £500. >> Of course you're not. No. Not Not everyone can afford that for one game. >> It's insane. I'm stunned by that. I really am. We can get your views on that. We'll take your calls after the independent football regulator found that a staggering 94% of English clubs are operating at a loss. >> Does our game need a hard reset? Is it just too expensive? Are we moving further and further away from the everyday football fan? Lots of questions. I'm I'm guessing lots of you will be irrating and annoyed about this. Uh you can air your frustration on our show. We'll take your calls in just a moment. 03717234. Right. Let's take your calls after the independent football regulator found that 94% of English football clubs are operating at a loss. Staggering. 03717234. That's the magic number. Paul the whole city founders dog. Paul, good afternoon to you. >> Melvin, how are you doing boys? All right. >> We are good. How are you? What do you make of all that madness? >> Well, I rang it might be a couple of years ago when this subject was on the go and I actually said that football will eventually eat itself. >> It'll get there's that much money coming in, but unfortunately there's even more money going out and this is what's going to happen. People will stop going. >> Well, see, here's the thing, right? I wish you were right because then they would they will be pushed into a corner and they'd have to react. But I don't think people will stop going. We've got who is it that was talking there's some one of the boys here was talking about they might have even been Benty actually about when you had Arsenal season tickets. >> Yeah. >> And all the people around him every week with different people because >> they're the tourists aren't they? They're the tourists what they do the package for. >> That's right. >> But you like Benty said earlier on the normal man in the street. >> I know. I know. I mean, what was it? 500 quid to go to a match. >> Well, I I think if there's three of you and you're paying 75 80 pound a ticket, right? Which is >> Yeah. >> I don't think you're getting the greatest seat by any means in house. That's 240 quid, right? You got to get there, petrol is going to be I know 50 quid. That's up to 300 quid. Now, >> you want food for the three of you, another 50 quid, 350. You want a match day program, it's 360, 370. Your kid wants something in the club shop, wants a shirt, you're up to, you're past 400 quid now. But the thing is I I wish I was on more than 500 quid a week, but I'm not. So I don't think my misses would be right happy if all of a sudden I took a week's wages and said to the lasses, >> "Oh, come on. Let's go to football. You can't eat for a week. Let's go." I soon go down the league. But >> Paul, you know what? I think this is the sad part about it. I don't think football care about the pool. >> They don't. They don't give a monkeys, man. No, they don't. They don't give a monkeys. Oh, by the way, this is Paul from the a lotment who I spoke to you last year about my daughter getting married and all the rest of it. >> Oh, nice. Good. Everything all right, Phil? Still married? >> Of course they are. >> Oh, good. >> Well, like I said, lad, fantastic show. >> Thanks, Paul. >> But unfortunately, football's going to die. >> Okay. I like I like your terminology. Football's eating itself. Aaron's a Villa fan. Hi, Aaron. >> How you doing, Andy? Are you okay? >> I'm good, thanks for asking. How are you today? Yeah, not too bad. Thank you. >> What would you like to say? What do you make of it? >> I think clubs who are spending I'm going to use Man United example. Instead of spending 200 million on a transfer window, they should have to pay 100 million off their debt before they start spending money. They need to try and reduce the debt before spending on new players. >> The problem is The problem is they earn so much money like in terms of abroad and the kind the way that that's the problem you've got. >> Yeah. you. Why are clubs allowed to spend so much money when they're millions and millions poundending extending people's contracts on bigger wages when they're millions and millions in debt? >> I think that's a fantastic point. I don't have the answer to that, but that's a fantastic point. >> Yeah. >> Why should you be allowed to keep if I've got a if I'm mortgaged double you call it re if I'm remortgage right up to my eyeballs, I can't then go out and buy a car or another house. I got to pay off that mortgage. >> Yeah. It should be like that with football clubs. If you got 800, no more, if you got more than 800 million pound debt, shouldn't be able to carry on. But >> I wonder if the the the regulators now will be able to stop that and go, "Listen, this can't happen." >> It may be. Maybe. This is the first time they've ever done this report. The government brought that in. >> No wonder, man, that might be a bit bother. >> Yeah. Hopefully, it's just the tip of the iceberg.