Arsenal's Rogers Pursuit & White House World Cup Chief on the Balogun Row | Ben Jacobs' Mailbag
The Balogun red card controversy takes centre stage as Andrew Giuliani is pressed on Donald Trump’s FIFA call, the White House’s role and the decision to suspend Folarin Balogun’s ban. Kate Mason is joined by Ben Jacobs for the latest transfer news, including Arsenal’s pursuit of Bruno Guimarães, Manchester United’s midfield plans and Tottenham’s interest in Cody Gakpo, Savinho, Junior Kroupi and Randal Kolo Muani. Ben also explains why Michael Edwards has left his role as FSG’s CEO of Football, why André Santos is set to join Manchester United and which midfield targets could still move before the window closes. Later, Andrew Giuliani, Executive Director of the White House Task Force for the World Cup, defends the response to Balogun’s red card in a heated interview covering FIFA’s disciplinary process, VAR, referee Rafael Claus and the wider relationship between football and politics. Henry Winter joins the show to reflect on England’s dramatic win over Mexico, assess Jude Bellingham’s influence and preview the World Cup quarter-final against Erling Haaland’s Norway. He also explains how England may try to contain Haaland and shares the details behind a security scare at the team’s Kansas City media base. Plus, Matchroom Boxing chairman Eddie Hearn gives his verdict on England’s World Cup chances, Jude Bellingham, Declan Rice and Harry Kane. Chapters: 00:00 Balogun Red Card: Trump, FIFA and the Appeal Row 05:23 Michael Edwards Exits FSG & Man Utd’s Midfield Plan 14:47 Arsenal Open Talks for Bruno Guimarães 18:43 Tottenham Target Gakpo, Savinho and Junior Kroupi 22:45 Could the Balogun Row Threaten Infantino’s FIFA Future? 32:32 Andrew Giuliani Defends the White House’s Balogun Role 46:47 England vs Norway: How to Stop Erling Haaland 58:26 Eddie Hearn on Bellingham, Kane and England’s World Cup All that and more on Market Madness. Arsenal WorldCup TransferNews You can get in touch with us too! Streaming on YouTube, Facebook, and X – or catch up anytime on your…
Transcript
[music] Hello and welcome to Market Madness, the podcast from Give Me Sport, where every day is just as good as deadline day. I'm Kate Mason and we are live. If you miss anything here, you can catch up with us on MarketMadness on your favorite podcast app or on givemeport.com. You can also find us all on X and on Instagram as well. We've got a packed lineup in this show today. We got transfer news of course, but we have also got an interview that Ben Jacobs has done with Andrew Giuliano, the executive director of the White House house task force for the World Cup. huge story this one concerning the Balagan red car. We're going to get straight into that and after that we will hear from Henry Winter and the boxing promoter and England fan Eddie Hearn. So let's get Ben Jacobs to join the show right away. Ben, great to see you. Really have been at the heart of a huge story in the US over the last few days. >> Yeah, it's been a fascinating World Cup on and off the field, hasn't it? And I revealed last sort of day or so that the FIFA president Jean Infantino had directly received a call from the US President Donald Trump and that was in the aftermath of Flo Balagan getting sent off in the game against Bosnia which was the round of 32. The US men's national team won that game and FIFA in the buildups their next game which was their loss to Belgium and a heavy loss and a deserve loss. So it became a kind of non-issue on the football field in the end because Belgium were just the better side. But nonetheless, the story rumbles on because Trump asked Infantino to review a oneame automatic suspension and the suspension got suspended and FIFA argue that this was their disciplinary committee and that it's independent and yet it's unprecedented because even Cristiano Ronaldo who got the two games suspended that would have seen him miss the opening two Portugal matches of the World Cup, that red card was the pregame banned from World Cup qualifying. And the big debate is basically, do FIFA via an independent panel have the discretion to suspend a ban even though it's never been done before at the World Cup? Or is that actually not the provisions within the World Cup rules to do that despite there is a clause article 27 that maybe legally opens up the possibility? And what I find fascinating, Kate, and I'd love to kind of know your opinion on this, is on the one hand, there's article 27. On the other hand, there are FIFA regulations specific to the tournament that make it clear there is no provision for any kind of appeal. On the one hand, you have the possibility that V protocol, as US Soccer argued, was not implemented correctly, and as a consequence, you have an argument put forwards by the White House and also by US Soccer that there were too many slow-mos, that there were too many still images, that everything was misrepresented. And yet you got Jerrell Quanser who also after that incident and that was a red card in my opinion had V look at it and he got sent off and then the disciplinary committee said there's no appeal process and it's a two game ban and there's nothing that England can do. So [clears throat] there appears to be wild lacks of consistency and my feeling Kate is that whether or not it was a red card for Balagan the Pandora's box that is open is every single federation now at this World Cup every single time they get a red card are going to be turning around and saying why can't Alban be suspended as well. It is a hugely controversial moment because of course exactly right the whole point that you're making so eloquently is and from speaking to Andrea Giuliani as well is that this is a the political arm of the US getting involved in a football matter and you're completely right as well of course about Kansa he won't be playing I would be interested to understand what the distinction is that has been made between that red card and between the US red card because I'd just like to see that in writing. so that I could understand that a bit more closely. We're going to uh dive more deeply into this as the show progresses, but you've got a little bit of transfer breaking news. So, we're going to go to that momentarily and then we'll talk more about this. So, stick around. If you're fascinated by everything going on with the US Red Card situation, then stick here. We are going to be talking about it. This is Market Madness from Give Me Sport. [music] And if we could also let's roll the breaking news stab as well. Here we go. [laughter] [music] >> Contractually prevented from revealing any breaking news without that breaking news. >> Doesn't count. It doesn't count [laughter] then. >> So yeah, if you want breaking news, we have to hear the stab. And I'm just going to roll a few bits into one. The first is that Michael Edwards has stepped down as FSG's CEO of football. And my understanding is that he actually informed FSG that he was leaving last autumn when it was clear that they were not going to be expanding their football portfolio. But Edwards chose to stay on nonetheless for a little bit longer even though he knew he was departing because he wanted to support Richard Hughes and also play a part in the appointment of Andoniola. But now is the right time for Edwards to go. It doesn't really impact Liverpool and their transfer business or anything Hughes related. Although we should point out that Hughes himself is expected to join Alhillal, but not during specifically this summer window. So, it's business as usual for Liverpool in the market, but Michael Edwards has decided to depart. And the main driving force behind his decision is that he was very much persuaded to return to FSG, remember, as CEO of football rather than Liverpool specifically because he had the ability at the time that he came back to the club to purchase a new football club to add to FSG's portfolio. Originally it was Bordeaux that Liverpool were looking at and then kind of in the November period last year GAFE looked possible but when that fell through Edward started to realize that FSG had changed their mind a little bit. So it wasn't only about not finding the right club it was about FSG deciding not to buy another club at all. And that still looks to be the case. And in the absence of the ability and the challenge to buy another standalone project to add to the FSG portfolio, Edwards has decided to move on. And in essence, it's probably fair to say even though it's a very amicable departure, that the role that Edwards thought he was walking to into didn't materialize and that's why he has decided to go. Now, the last time that Edwards left Liverpool, he was basically intent on taking a very extended break from football. That's not the case on this occasion. And my information is that Edwards is likely to jump straight back into work. Straight back into work in the confines of leaving and the confines of any potential restrictions and all of that. So, I'm not implying that it will be like right now and necessarily this summer, but don't be surprised if it's a quick return to work. And there is firm interest in Edwards uh from a number of projects and clubs both within the Premier League and in Saudi Arabia as well. So, keep an eye on Edward's next step because I don't think we'll have to wait that long to find out where he's going. And then just two quick bits of transfer news to bring you as well. One is relating to Jawa Gomez and my understanding here is that his proposed move to Atletico Madrid has now stalled despite the fact that there was an agreement between the clubs. Wolves are now working on the assumption that Atletico Madrid have moved on to other midfield targets despite the fact they haven't formally been informed that this deal is off. And I can confirm suggestions that Atletico Madrid are unhappy with the super agent George Menddees, who of course plays a part in these kind of deals. And the reason why is because Atleti thought at one point in time that they might get Bernardo Silva, another George Mendes client, and he went to their Madrid rivals, Real Madrid, instead. And now Atletico Madrid have decided not to do business on this particular deal. and will look for other midfielders and Wolves as I say are working on the premise that the player will go elsewhere and then it's also just worth noting that even though we might not get official confirmation today the deal for Andre Santos to Manchester United is done and he has signed that deal. It's a five-year contract and a one-year option. The fee is 48 million2 million in add-ons. So, Andre Santos now is officially a Manchester United player from Chelsea pending only the formal club announcement. I think you're muted, Kate, which means you have to take a sip of water. [sighs] >> Let me out. Save me. Save me. Thanks, Ben. We're going to get more into that [laughter] in in a moment's time, but for now, this is Market Madness from Give Me Sport. [music] Because yeah, it is mailbag time on market madness. Ben, thank you for that breaking news as well. It was chocka block already, but we've got much more to come to. Uh should we then talk about Man United then? Because uh that's that's an interesting step in the progress to their uh midfield changes in this window. Uh the Santos deals gone through, the Edison deal, question mark. And is the plan still to sign a marquee midfielder in amongst all that? >> Yeah, I mean Manchester United probably don't use the word marquee but I think it's fair to say statement signing and they'll celebrate the signing of Andre Santos as a real coup because even though Manchester United fans are perhaps quite disappointed and rightly so I think it's fair to say because Elliot Anderson was the top target. They never bid. He went to Man City. Matteas Fernandez they were working on for quite a long time. Tottenham came in and put 85 million on the table. Chumeni would have been widely accepted as that marquee signing from the fan base's point of view if we want to use that terminology. Again, he's extended at Real Madrid and that should be formal probably after the World Cup new deal until 2031. So add all of that up and Manchester United have not yet got the name that will excite the fan base in the way that those signings did. And Tonali was on the list too. Talks with Bruno Gimmere, Arsenal going for the player. So I can understand why Manchester United fans are angry. And yet with Andre Santos, Chelsea fans are quite disappointed at large that he's going. Brazil journalists that I've spoken to when I've covered Brazil at this World Cup feel that he can step into the shoes of Casemiro and be Brazil's next number six. So keep an eye on this Andre Santos signing because there's a reason why Manchester United value him at 50 million pounds. And I think that those that are moaning that he isn't one of those other names might over time be won over by a player like Andre Santos who is a top talent but obviously still has some development to go as well. So that sort of Santos situation it came about seemingly very quickly but as we actually revealed on GMS in March the interest was there the door was just shut because at that point Chelsea didn't want to sell but Santos has been looking for more game time and minutes and Chelsea were prepared suddenly to sanction it I think following the departure of Liam Rosinhia in particular because he was a big Santos fan and now Manchester United have been able to move very quickly on that one with Edison We have to respect the fact that Man United are looking very carefully at medical tests and I'll keep you posted when they make a decision and there will be another midfielder in my opinion. Alex Scott is one to keep an eye on. We know that Arsenal like the player but at the moment they're working on Bruno Gimmere. Chelsea have looked in the past as well and Man City have had Alex Scott on their radar too. Key to that deal is going to be whether or not Scott's prepared to sign a new deal at Bournemouth. If he is, then we're talking about a summer 2027 saga, likely with a release clause. If he isn't, then maybe Bournemouth are persuaded to sell. Although again, when I speak to Bournemouth sources, they say, "Plan A, new deal. Plan B, we'll just take another year off the contract." And yet, I'm told the valuation for Alex Scott, if he doesn't sign a new deal, will be in and around80 million pounds. So, let's see whether Manchester United move there because the player is high in their thinking. Jawa Gomez historical target for Manchester United and now that move with Atletico Madrid has fallen through. Let's see whether they choose to visit that one. Sanderberg, Tyler Adams, all options. But I think if Man United did any of those players other than Alex Scott, the fan base would continue to point to the fact that other clubs have made bigger and more marquee names. And yet that's kind of more a fan debate, right? Because recruitment teams don't like to get sucked into this idea of who is or isn't a marquee signing because anyone a club signs. They obviously back and believe that they can be big stars otherwise what's the point in signing them. So Manchester United internally are staying calm. It's a long window with half the window still remaining and I still expect come the end of the window Manchester United to get what they need in a variety of positions. >> Okay. So Manchester United has in your reasoning signed a marquee midfielder, a he's they've made a marquee signing, perhaps just not the marquee signing. Uh you mentioned Gimme. Uh Arsenal. What's the latest on that? >> So Arsenal are expected to formally open talks with Newcastle United for Bruno Gimme even though Newcastle flatly deny any contact and say the player is not for sale. And this is going to be really interesting because I don't think we're going to get an Alexander Each situation where the player returns from the World Cup and starts throwing his toys out the pram or saying he doesn't want to play for Newcastle United. Gimmere is not like that. He's been Newcastle through and through. They call him a Brazilian Jordi. And yet it's very clear the player would like to join and that has been directly communicated to Newcastle United. My understanding is that a lot of the talks so far have taken place through so-called super agents with mandates to do the deal and intermediaries. And in those verbal conversations, Arsenal have made it clear they're prepared to go up to 65 million pounds. And Newcastle's valuation of Bruno Gimmere, if they change their not for sale stance, is more like 80 to 90 million. And I think they're entitled to that number because we're in an inflated market. And people will say he's older than some of the other names or there's less contract than these players that have got four, five years left, etc. or there's not a bidding war. But we've seen instances in this window where players with one year on their contract have still gone for big money. If Jean Paul Van Hecker, even though he's not in Bruno Gimez's position, is 52 million with contract winding down moving to Tottenham, then of course Newcastle United are going to say, "We want more for Bruno Gimmere." And it's the fact that there's urgency for Arsenal to find a midfielder. And like I say, we're in a market that just has crazy valuations. So, I think Newcastle are gonna stick to their number. And my feeling is they'll want more than Anthony Gordon going to Barcelona for 70 million if this deal is going to happen. And like I say, the starting valuation for Newcastle for Bruno Gimmere is somewhere between 80 and 90 million pounds. But Arsenal are expected to bid and maybe when they go directly to Newcastle United, the games and all the things sometimes you get around smoke and mirrors and noise when you're going through third parties disappear. And then we'll understand whether Newcastle are prepared for this to drag on a little bit during the summer if they stick to their not for sale position or alternatively they've learned some lessons from the ESAC saga and if Gimz wants to go they eventually say okay on the right terms we'll let it happen. But what adds to a thickened plot in all of this is that Bura doesn't do business like most sporting directors. So if this was most other Premier League clubs, you'd say Bura gets in a room with the Newcastle hierarchy. They start directly negotiating. If they can bridge the golf and valuation, the deal gets done. And yet Bura will do two or three of these deals to the point of almost completion. So at the same time as negotiating via intermediaries for Bruno Gimme, Andrea Berta has also been engaged in an inquiry for Alex Scott. Arsenal have Buaddi from Morocco on their radar. They had previously looked at both San Sandro Tanali and Matteas Fernandez and yet they'd felt the cost for each was too high and ultimately in the case of Tanali because of Roberto Deserby he wanted to go to Tottenham. So Bura loves to spin multiple plates which means if Arsenal get Bruno Gimmere great and if they don't they'll have other contingencies. >> Okay, brilliant stuff Ben. We've got a lot to get through here. Let me just I just want to be kept honest with your time because I know obviously you got you got games to get to tonight. Do we have seven more minutes? Is it the top of the hour you're getting out of time? >> Well, you whiz through in seven minutes and then I'm off to Spain, Belgium. >> Lucky man. Very lucky man. All right, seven minutes to go everybody. Let's look at all of this with that in mind and and you'll forgive me if I then go to uh Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. Um so Gina Krooppy um is someone that's been linked with Spurs. I'd like to know if they are front runners for him. He's such a good player and really feels like someone that Tottenham need. There's this interesting rumor now on that Kolo Manei is being I don't understand what that could possibly be that he might be being they want to keep him. Surely not. And uh are they in competition? I've also seen Spurs connected with Cresencio Somerville um as well as Cevin obviously. >> Yeah. So somerville was a story that we broke on GMS and Man United obviously as well have been engaged in talks too and his future is going to be one to watch now that he's returned from the World Cup. So Somerville I think will leave West Ham still even though from a financial point of view West Ham are on more par and Manchester United and Spurs the two Premier League clubs there. Tottenham looking for a left-sided winger. They have really been since last summer. They've done their defense. They've done their midfield. Now it's about the attack for Spurs. Cinho is another option. Keep an eye on Cody Gakpo as well if he genuinely becomes available at an affordable number because Spurs quite like him as well. It's just that Liverpool are not desperate to sell despite the arrival of Victor Munos and no doubt another versatile attacker as well. But if Gako was and he hasn't yet to ask Liverpool to leave and valuation was met, maybe in the second half of the window something could be possible there. So he's one of a list of several options over on that left hand side. And Junior Krippy as well I can confirm is a player that Tottenham like Manchester United had looked in the past actually before he ended up making the move to Bournemouth and then you have clubs like Manchester City and Arsenal as well. But it all depends on Bournemouth who are calm about that situation. So we shouldn't work on the premise that Scott Krooppy Jr. are definitely leaving Bournemouth. We might get scenarios where Bournemouth dig in on one or both. The internal conversations between Junior Krooppy and Alex Scott with Bournemouth are at the moment more important than any external club approaches because Bournemouth feel like they're going to have the ability to clarify with the players first and pitch the possibility of eac