‘They don’t have any rules in the dressing room’ - Steve Nicol on issues at Real Madrid | ESPN FC

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ESPN FC on Real Madrid's dressing-room disorder, Mourinho and the Mbappe debate

The panel discusses whether Real Madrid's dressing room still lacks discipline, the fan backlash over Mbappe's off-field behaviour, and whether Mourinho should crack down harder. The conclusion is that the dressing room lacks self-policing, the Mbappe project has not delivered trophies, and fan unrest is real even if selling him now seems extreme.

Alex Kirkland, Frank Leboeuf, Ale Moreno and Steve Nicol join Alexis Nunes on ESPN FC to discuss Real Madrid’s issues ahead of their matchup against Villarreal. ✔️ Subscribe to ESPN Unlimited: https://plus.espn.com/ ESPN ESPNFC

Transcript

Get excited because La Liga is back and we have got a triple header on the ESPN app on Saturday. It all starts off with Alves against Atletico de Madrid. Then Barcelona against Hetaf. Shaka Hoff and I will be walking you through that one. Al Moreno on the call as well. And then Real Madrid against Via Real. A lot of eyes will be on that game. Let's remind you how things are standing in the top half of the La Liga table. Barcelona already six points ahead of Madrid. Look at that. And it's actually Atletico de Madrid who are in second place. But let's talk more about Jose Mourinho's side as we're going to welcome in Alex Kirkland joining us right now because Alex, there have been some controversial reports over in the headlines in Madrid, mainly surrounding Jose Mourinho and many thinking that he like many before him has lost a dressing room. >> Yeah. As you as you suggest, this is nothing new, is it? Real Madrid. We've been hearing from a long time from all kinds of people that the atmosphere inside the Real Madrid dressing room is is not great. You know, that wasn't the case at the end of the Angelotti era. It was the same last season. Last year, it was very very public, of course, cuz some of the players basically effectively got Shabonzo sacks and then got his successor Alvarabaloa sacks as well at the end of the season. And most publicly of all, you know, one player literally ended up in hospital with concussion after clashing with a teammate. So we knew that the dress room atmosphere has been kind of toxic at Real Madrid for a long time. Jose Mour Mourinho was brought in in a big part I think to sort that out to restore discipline to crack down on player power to make sure that it isn't just the star players who are running the show as has been the case for the last couple of years and so far I think the evidence at least is that that hasn't been the case. You know you talk to people and they tell you that not much has changed. It isn't that different to what we saw last season or even the season before that Mourinho hasn't come in with a you know an iron fist like you might expect that Jose Mourinho evolved. Um now it's still early days in terms of the season in terms of the table in terms of the team's form. There's lots of time to to turn things around and yet the situation is what it is. six-point gap as we were on the table with Barcelona classicalico coming up there this month and big games to come before that and a bit of kind of growing unrest I think among the among the fans that could be turned around but right now I think given the situation that is the case a lot of fans are starting to ask well how much has changed how much is different from last year or the year before >> well Alex you mentioned that fans are starting to ask a lot of questions they're also starting to ask a lot of questions about Kian Mbappe we had Jim on the show earlier this week where she talked about how a lot of them seem to ticked off with some of his off the- pitch activities in this international break. >> Yeah, the thing with when you take any of these incidents on an isolated level, none of them seem that serious. You know, we we saw it last season, end of last season, he was injured. The season was still going on. He was pictured on holiday with his partner on a on a yacht. Maybe on its own, that's not the end of the world. It didn't go down well. This year um we've had already things like during the international break he was injured with France he could you know he came back to Madrid briefly and then went back to Paris was pictured in Paris did some of his treatment in Paris and uploaded that video of himself riding a bike when Jose Bour had specifically named bike riding something a football player cannot do in an interview just a couple of weeks ago. Um, again this week, yes, he's been back in full training for a couple of days now, but there was reports that on Tuesday he was, you know, training in the morning and he was back in France in in the afternoon with Mbappe. I think look, of course, he scored a lot of goals. Of course, he's one of the best players in the world. But again, there's a substantial contingent, I think, of fans now who at least are starting to question, well, you know, is the fact we haven't won a major trophy for two years. Is it linked to this guy being here? Does he care about that as much as I do? Is he focused on that as much as he is on scoring goals and winning the balon door? Now, that might be unfair and that might not reflect how he sees things, but I think there's definitely a growing current among Real Madrid fans and we've seen it a bit already in the last year or so. He has been whistled at times by by fans of the Bernard Bale not being happy with this project of which he of course is is the figurehead as the star player. Frank, >> if there's one thing >> that will upset a dressing room is your main guy on the face of it doing what he wants and everybody, >> there's other rules for them >> straight off the bat. Never mind all the personal stuff that some guys don't like this guy and blah blah, >> but your main guy is swaning around doing exactly what he wants when every pretty much everybody else in the dressing room knows that if that was them, they'd be getting fined. They'd be getting slap in the back and what whatever it may be right off the bat. So you have no chance of winning the big prizes when particularly your top guy is swaning around doing what he fancies. That just doesn't work. >> Frank, this is your boy and they're coming after your boy. So much so that even Leip has been reporting that now his future at Real Madrid is in doubt. Is it really that serious to you? Well, if his future in Real Madrid is in doubt, I want to know who's going to be able to hire Kan Mbappe with the kind of behavior that he has. Uh the selfishness that is showing to the world, uh the the not listening to the coach who ask him to be a bit more discreet, you know, if you're if you're a coach and if you're chairman of a club or sporting director, you say, "Will it be a good idea?" Yes, he's a great player, fantastic player. Alex, stop saying he's the best player in the world. It doesn't mean anything. But he's a great player on his position, the best maybe at his position. But really, do we want him? Do we want somebody who only think about him or his real target is to be the Balandor but not winning the Liga or maybe the Champions League. So that's the prime. I I I'm really fond of Kan Mbappe. I know him. I met him. He was a great guy with all the the the the education need. I don't know what to answer about that and what we can do about Skil Mbappe. I really thought that Jose Mourinho would be the guy to say, "Oh, no. I'm fed up with that. You don't listen to me. You don't do what I want. I don't care if you scale eight goals. You go on the bench because you don't you're not part of the the project that I want and the project that I want is to you work with the guys at the same level." And that's not the case. As Stevie say, he seems to be like he he's allowed to do whatever he wants or he doesn't want to follow instructions and that's a problem. That's really a problem. >> I'm also >> Is being harsh Al >> cuz is this really a big deal? I don't feel like he's done anything that wrong. >> Um it's a continuation. It's sustained behavior. That's what it makes it a big deal. >> And while I'm all for players not paying attention to what we have to say because in the big scheme of things, breaking news, what we say doesn't really matter. is not all that important, right? And so, while I understand that he wouldn't be paying attention to the media and whatever shows like this have to say, I do think that there is something to be said about not being tonedeaf >> and recognizing the realities of your club and the situation that your club and the pressure that your club is under. And last season, they were about to lose the title to Barcelona in Eláico in Barcelona. He had me he had a hamstring injury at the time and he was doing his rehab when well in a yacht somewhere with his girlfriend right okay let let me just tell you not ideal not ideal ideal for other things but not ideal for rehab and and so uh and then he didn't show up for that classicalico he didn't even make the trip so as his team was floundering as his team were literally punching each other out inside the locker room the roof was caving in the superstar was in a yacht somewhere. That is not a good look. And so it's tonedeaf. It's not recognizing what is required of you as a superstar of a team, as a leader of a team. And then you continue that behavior to this season in which if your manager just said, "Don't be riding a bike." Okay, fine. You want to go ride a bike because you're feeling it, huh? You this is something that you want to do. Okay, you need the fresh air. you want to ride the bike around a park, go ahead and do that if you so desire, but don't film yourself doing it and put it on Instagram. >> So, it's it's again, it's being tonedeaf. It's just not it's it's to Steve's point, it's just doing whatever you want regardless of what the what the world is saying. And and what again, I think it's important that players don't really listen to what's going on in the rest of the world. You need to know what's going on in your club. >> That's your responsibility. You need to know what's going on in your locker. You need to know what's going on with your manager because that is your responsibility. That is what why you're there to be a participant, a natural active participant in the everyday activities of your club. And this guy is he's more concerned about his balandor campaign, a campaign that by the way is trophyless, >> is without trophies. And yet he is more concerned about that and getting his votes and getting his message across the balonor instead of getting himself ready and fit to go and play and score goals for Real Madrid and do so consistently so and be part of this team on a day-to-day basis, not just when he wants to. >> And you know another thing that happens in a proper dressing room >> Mhm. is that you know the first time when you do something there's somebody in the dressing room the next morning the first chance they get walks straight up to you and says who do you think you are >> well we're all here and you're swaning away on your your yacht and everybody's made a mistake >> once but once is okay >> and if you do it the once the dressing room should be telling you okay just what I said you make a mistake don't do that again. You're making us all look bad for a start. But guess what? He didn't. He's done it again. >> So clearly in the dressing room, there's no sort of there's there's there's no guts. There's no there's no rules. Every dressing room, everybody in there knows the rules. Knows what certain situations. This is what we do and this is what we don't do. And clearly they don't have any rules in the dressing room. And when you don't have rules in the dressing room, it carries onto the field. And what you're seeing, >> it's up to the manager though to get that those rules in. >> The the manager can do a certain amount. The manager can do a certain amount, but the manager is not in the dressing room. >> The manager find it's a tough one that you know, unless unless you've got a lot of young guys and the majority of your your important players are listening to you and and they want to learn, want to get better, they want to be a unit, all of these good things that you need. But this dressing room is full of experienced guys who want to do what they want to do. >> And so the manager, in my opinion, in my opinion, the manager can do not enough about that is to do with the dressing room. And unless you get rid of a load of them, >> it's not changing. It's not changing. >> Go ahead, Frank. Um I don't know if TV have known that and Ali as well but at Chelsea for example we had we had to sign um internal rules book every year. That's something that we made up u inside the locker room about you know be somebody being late uh somebody not turning up somebody being uh you know uh uh taken in pictures with in the in the newspapers in a bar whatever it could be to be fine and at the end of the day to at the end of the year to have a nice restaurant where we paid and there was a there was a pool and you put the money down and that was part of something that we made up because of the rules that we wanted to install and settle between each other. And I tell you when you had Dennis Weise, you had some other players like Marcel Doai uh and you had Janlu Cavali and Rud Gulit and you you had those players who say what did you do last night? We saw you in a in a with a paparazzi they show you they took pictures of you are showing the shame of the club. That's what it is. But that's what it was. That's what Stevie meant in the dressing room. we met our own rules and and and uh well watch any given Sunday. That's the biggest example what a dressing room can do. That's the one of the best movie to explain collective sport. is where the coach say something then he goes apart then the the player they do their own rules and with players who doesn't want to listen to that or don't stick to it they're going to be punished in a mainly way >> and and you were making the point as to that would be the manager's responsibility >> let me just say managers have tried with this locker room >> yeah that's the thing >> huh it it carons anaro. And now we get to Mourinho. Melo Mourinho who's not my favorite version this Melo Mourinho because I need to see more emotion from him is he's if he's going to wrangle this this players together. But for more context, part of the reason that Kbapp was not playing with France is because in the first game he got injured hyperextending his knee. LOOK, FOR ANYBODY WHO'S RIDING A BIKE, YOU'RE ALWAYS EXTENDING YOUR KNEE WHEN YOU'RE RIDING A BIKE. AND THIS MAN IS OUT THERE RIDING a bike. I just don't understand if I guess these players nowadays just don't either they have too many people around them or not enough people around them to say but your coach just said to not be doing this in a in a public forum and you are injured you have a bad knee a bum knee that's why you're not playing with your national team what are YOU DOING RIDING A BIKE IN PUBLIC AND AND doing the video I this this doesn't make any sense whatsoever for unless he's doing it on purpose and that's the part that is troubling unless Unless he's just doing it because I can do whatever I want and that's trouble >> we're talking about. I mean, as Al pointed out, two seasons, no trophies. He is scoring goals though. But now we're still seeing him back under the transfer rumors. Just how realistic are these doubts uh for his future at Real Madrid? >> Look, transfer rumors, speculation about him leaving, that's another level. That's something else. I think it's still quite hard to imagine that kind of scenario. remember how hard Mid had to work to bring him here. How hard he had to work and how long he had to wait to come here as well to get out of of PSG. That's another step. But what I think we can say is that so far, you know, two years and a bit in, the project hasn't delivered. It hasn't worked. They haven't won trophies. They're looking right now, unless things change, unless this dynamic changes at the potentially a third season without a major trophy. And that is failure. And at that point, something has to change. You know, I think sort of hitting the the red button and selling Mbappe, I don't know about that. I think you do all kinds of things before you before it gets that radical, but it's it's not working. It's and like I say, there is a substantial group, I think, now of Real Madrid fans at the Bernabu, maybe we'll see and hear it on Saturday, who are not happy with him and what he's doing because they feel like those goals aren't enough. Are enough of those goals coming in in big games and are enough of those goals resulting in getting the points you need to win the league or to go all the way in the in the Champions League? And that is not happening. So like I say, transfer speculative on beep feels to me like a a step too far. But that undercurrent of of of unrest and and discontent and questioning him and and questioning this project is very real. >> All right, Alex, before we let you go, just remind us which game you're at this weekend. >> I will be at the Bernabo to see how the fans react. >> You'll be getting ready to hear those whistles. >> All right, Alex Kirkland, thank you so much for joining us. We'll catch up with you again this weekend for that game.