Is The Chelsea Project Back on Track?
Ben and Angus are joined by Scott Trotter, Chelsea Writer of Football London to evaluate the current state of the Chelsea Project. And, Fabrizio Romano dishes on the very latest in the January transfer window.
Transcript
hello once again and welcome to the debrief live I'm anger Scott what a month it is turning out to be on the transfer front dragas in and Verner in at Spurs Sancho and D now in Germany our transfer Guru Fabricio Romano will be here shortly with all the latest news for Chelsea it's been relatively quiet a few loans out and some recalls but nothing to get too excited about does that mean things are calming down at Stanford Bridge well even if that's true Ben Jacobs always gets us excited with news from the bridge Ben good afternoon to you good afternoon I don't think Chelsea is ever calm but you're absolutely right in what you say they haven't moved yet so we're either going to be in for a surprise quiet normal day at Chelsea or we're gonna have a crazy few weeks ahead I think the latter for you Ben definitely and you know it um and also with us today is Scott Trotter from football London always great to have another Scott on the show Scott welcome to the debrief thank you very much for having me hey it's uh it's our pleasure right where are we Scott do you think on H Chelsea's plans to turn the club around um a difficult one I guess looking at it from kind of a broad stroke approach um kind of mid-table you would say not very far far through I think um I think the summer you know the the club's ownership uh took charge of the club 18 months or so ago now but I think the summer really was the big starting point for the club they obviously put in place their own sporting team the likes of Lawrence Stewart and Paul winly about 12 months ago and kind of from that point we're seeing more of what Chelsea want to do what stamp on the club they hope to have and and obviously you know last summer kind of the arrival of Marcio pettino and almost unprecedented turnover both incomings and outgoings uh for the club and things since then I guess have taken a little while to settle there's been a massive number of injuries so things are kind of we're still learning a lot about what this Chelsea squad has to offer what maybe they're capable of they're obviously still in the caribel cup though of course had that defeat to Middlesboro I think for the the first time what feels like a long time that they moved into the top half of the table away from 10th position I think this week after the win over Fulham but still massive kind of uncertainty around the club I guess and maybe you know transfer window brings up more questions as always but yeah still lots of work for Chelsea to do and I think yeah maybe a Discord in terms of what to expect when you have this billion pound figure that's so often hanging over the club and what that should mean for how quickly they should see success as well yeah Ben you've been with it all the way through from sort of behind the scenes seeing how this this takeover has been managed where do you feel uh the board and the owners now feel they are 18 months into this project presumably a little bit happier because results are just beginning to turn a corner potentially well I think the same thing happened with gry and Potter there was a run that staved off the pressure and then they took two steps backwards having made one step forward so the ownership at Chelsea perhaps appreciate that there have been challenges and I think everybody accepts that it's been a slower process but part of the ambition comes I think with risk simply because Chelsea is a big club with a huge history of winning trophies and when you have this amount of change this fast and spend so much money there has to be an instant return and a now part to the project that has been lacking whereas the future stuff is very intriguing and could well pay off but I think fans and this is where the noise comes from are getting worried and frustrated and putting scrutiny on all of the PW like patience progress and ultimately project and 18 months on I think that Chelsea are in a better place in terms of structure and I think the owners have always tried to ignore some of the noise even though my understanding is they'd listen to the fan base and they can at times even be swayed by it but ultimately they've got a business strategy they're well of aware of their own finances and they are still confident that this will pay off in the long run both for Chelsea and in the multiclub model but in the short term there's an acceptance for example that the 100 day review happened very fast and there was a lot of board upheaval and there were exits on the recruitment side before there were hires then I think there was a feeling that they were swayed in the market and there were clearly a few Panic Buys in the first window and that was normal because Todd bowy was sporting director he hadn't done it before and Thomas tuul was obviously there and suddenly gone and his relationship with bowy and bed egg barley was not ideal professionally speaking if we're talking about Tuco being the right fit strategically and as a personality so that was a factor them flash forwards and they obviously had a big summer and a big January but January's tough midseason poter was under pressure he went poino comes in the first window that poino joins there's naturally going to be a beding in Period and Chelsea's recruitment team had already had plans in place so we're now in a position where this the first window where po chatino has bedded in it's probably only the second or third when the recruitment team has bedded in Chelsea have had a bunch of injuries it's a young Squad they've had a lot of scrutiny on them so I think these teething problems and these challenges even if some of them could have been foreseen are normal in many ways and I think that when I talked Chelsea sources my overriding feeling is that they accept there's been an unstable period And they also accept that the team is lower than they want because the aim for this season was still Champions League football before a ball was kicked but that's not actually made them question their project and they still believe that this overarching plan in the long term will pay off and also is progressing but but this this plan you talk about Ben is it Chelsea focused or is it multisport um focused with eyes elsewhere and Chelsea is just a bit part of that well it's both so you've got blueco and you've got Chelsea and blueco is multic club and they've got Strasburg Almost 100% And they're looking in the market in South America and in Europe and the multic club allows for the buying of Youth and Pathways and remember this isn't only about Chelsea and feeding up to Chelsea this is also about essentially cashing in on your failures so everyone you bring you hope is a success maybe they end up at Chelsea maybe they find a level at Strasburg or another club that they invest in but if they don't the key thing is that from a multic club perspective the fees have to be Investments not expenses and if they're Investments not expenses then if the player works out you've got a bargain financially speaking and you've got them young and ahead of the market if they don't work out you can sell them and still make a profit so it's win-win either for Chelsea or from a financial perspective so there's an element of City football group build up to Chelsea there's an element of Red Bull let a player start in the group and then if they're not a fit for the group ultimately because there's no Pathway to Chelsea you sell them and that helps blueco at least balance their books and all that's very well but I think Scott from Chelsea's point of view fans at the moment maybe won't care too much about multiclub model they just want to know about Chelsea they want to know where the goals are coming from where the leadership's coming from and where the identity is coming from and Chelsea has to almost even though it's a bit inverse strategically for a multic club model Chelsea I sense has to get it right first before there will be buying for the multic club strategy because one to the fans is about the now and one might sound very exciting but is ultimately not just Chelsea focused and has to be more for the future and if Chelsea isn't fixed first then it might be very difficult for this fan base to get on board yeah for sure and I think you know Chelsea if nothing else in in its history has been about results it has been about winning trophies and that is something that they have I guess prided and made their identity from and you know it's not too long ago that that they had Champions League success in I guess what you could have considered a fow period for the club in terms of maybe where they were at in the development obviously a lot of those players have since moved on I think you know this idea of all these young guys who have been signed in the summer and that kind of combines with a lot of this kind of multiclub model Focus signing players while they're young while the value can appreciate while you can get a good deal is all well and good but then to hear it kind of maybe an excuses Tad dramatic but here it used as a an excuse for why the club aren't succeeding on the pitch as quickly as what you know supporters are used to doesn't really cut the mustard and I think you know it gets talked about all the time that the billion pounds spend that puts an outside pressure on maybe not from fans who do have a little bit more understanding when they see what kinds of players have been signed but that pressure is always there and when you see you know the likes of Manchester City Liverpool even Arsenal to an extent kind of thriving I think what is probably not helped this season is how well Tottenham started the season as well they kind of went through their own transformation under the summer under a new boss and that that's obviously a real test and I guess the challenge really is at the moment it's not because Chelsea aren't challenging for the Premier League not challenging for the Champions League it's because they have been a mid-table team and maybe there's been some protection because of how poor last season was but I think there is that moment and we saw it after that middesboro result and a few other kind of disappoint results of that I think there's an element a cohort of the fans who are ready to kind of turn on perhaps the manager or the owners um because of these the disappointing results and you know the only way to stay that off will be by winning and showing that they can contend for a European spot as well yeah I mean if you if you win it all fans keep quiet don't they they don't care how it is you just want to be further up the table and and and any sort of reshaping of a club needs to happen as as quickly as possible if you're sitting standing on The Terraces you just want your your team to be better uh do keep your comments coming in we welcome them uh already coming in from smoke signals the Chelsea model is simply in progress fans have to be patient this is a total rebuild would you suggest Ben this is a total rebuild as opposed to sort of tinkering around the edges to perfect the model well it's a four- window strategy for Chelsea regardless of the bigger picture and part of that is inheritance of an older squads some players wanted to depart some Chelsea wanted to keep but they were unable to do so in the last summer window and goo kante is a good example but in that first window you're talking about a range of players rudiger is one example that wanted to leave and then when you add the fact that there's a need in this project to get the average age down and we're not talking about a bunch of 16 17 18 year olds there's also that replacing a 30 32 year old with a 21 25y old potentially as well so it's 25 and under and a revamp in different areas was needed out of necessity I think under Thomas tukul who was screaming at that time for center backs and also ended up bringing in aubameyang towards the end of the window which felt like very much a two call signing but a bit of a panic by in many ways and then now flashing forwards it's been more of a Midfield revamp and we've obviously seen Enzo Fernandez come in in the January before this one and also Moises kaiso for big money and Romeo Lavia as well and then when you add Leslie uuku and Conor Gallagher is still there there definitely has been a revamp but when you revamp one area you then start to look at the next one and the next one so they've brought in a couple of young goalkeepers and Petrovic is doing well center backs were a big priority they sorted that Midfield was a big priority they sorted that but within this one billion still no Elite level Striker that you feel is going to get you 20 plus goals so I think I think the priority for Chelsea is a revamp within the project both to get the quality and challenge for the champions league and ultimately the title but also at the same time to give longevity so then it's a new era under this ownership and once they've done it all in this four window strategy hopefully things will calm down because remember moving in a window as exciting as it is can be very negative and this is why if Liverpool don't move it's usually because they're happy with what they've got so doing nothing in a window can be a sign of a healthy Club doing too much in a window can be a sign of a club that's got things wrong in the past and has greater urgency but add to that also the injuries that Chelsea have had too and naturally they have to change their strategy a bit Scott and look in the market in areas that they maybe were not planning for and I don't know what your opinion is on this but I was looking at the starting 11 against Fulham and then I was thinking what kind of similarities will I see let's just say first game of next season will petravic be in goal or will it be back to Sanchez will Levi Cowell be at left back or will he be starting at Center back Silva can have left the club do Sassi might not be the starting center back and obviously when ree James is fit Malo Gusto won't be the right back you then look at that Midfield and you say well it is probably Enzo fernandz and Moises kaiso but that means maybe no Connor Gallagher he played further forwards against Fulham but kungu is going to come back Co Palmer's going to be in that side Raheem Sterling started the game but maybe mudri starts the first game of next season and there's almost no way that Brer would start so when I added it up with the injuries I realized that it's maybe only four or five that are guaranteed a start if everybody is fit so do you sort of sense Scott that the project plan is one thing but the need to move in a different direction be flexible and adapt because of circumstances whether that's injuries or a lack of leadership is actually a more pressing concern for Chelsea at the moment and that's why maybe in this market and maybe in their model they need to be able to change their strategy a little bit to be more now focused yeah and I think a lot of that is where the uncertainty Rises because I think the injuries not only does it kind of create this question of should they move now to find an answer that can maybe help them towards the end of the season it's they still don't know what they've actually got in the squad for the long term because they've not been able to try and utilize all of these players to see where they fit in they don't know whether Christopher onunu is going to adapt to the Premier League and deliver you know 10 20 goals in the season to you know stop them needing somebody like an aan or a Tony there that uncertainty is kind of creating a moment of pause for the club they they still need to kind of consider what is best in in all those positions you mentioned because they have had so many injuries and I think even just thinking back to to preseason we saw how important en kungu was going to be but probably also car Shu meca um they kind of fulfilled the same role on the team but obviously both were out within you know two weeks of the season starting and we saw formation changes and something quite different to what we'd seen develop out in the United States maybe there's a hint that that could return now um with with both those guys nearer returns and yeah I think there is just so much uncertainty obviously cwell has been a massive talking point for for fans and anybody interested in football given his his prowess in the center of Defense but chill well came back against form and once again was was utilized on the wing so that that is kind of these areas have really big questions there's questions over Thiago Silva's future going forward could this finally be his last season at 39 at Chelsea does that see Colwell moving and things move on in that regard again it is just so uncertain and that's what makes the you know the last two weeks of this window really interesting I think obviously you mentioned about that kind of four window plan I think there is some notion in the forward positions in particular that either by the end of this window or the next window there could be you know that big money forward arrive or the group that they've got will have shown that they have the ability to carry the burden and that's where Chelsea lie and I think you know the next six months is going to be a massive period of Discovery um you mentioned the Midfield obviously they signed the big signings Conor gallaga played way better than I think anybody at the club probably expected them to into the season he was probably expected to leave last summer um obviously uncertainty around his future once again and I think they obviously have to be careful in multiple regards because I think there's a consideration that yes Gallagher's played well but it's how long can he sustain that quality for is that the level of player he now is or is you know this this kind of touted s should they receive a fee and it won't be cheap um is it still right for the club in in the long term for him to perhaps move on and I think you know there are all these conversations floating around the sport and directors they obviously in conversation with pochettino probably every day at the moment and the owners and you know I think looking at last January and and how Enzo Fernandez wasn't going to happen at one stage and then you get into the last couple of days and it does any anything could still happen in the last two weeks with Chelsea we do keep your comments uh coming we'll get through as many questions a little bit later on but um a big part of this project is of course is spending and transfers so let's chat to our transfer Guru the one and only Fabrizio romano and find out what the transfer news is from Chelsea and elsewhere Fabricio good to have you with us again now let's start by talking about Chelsea that's our topic of the podcast this week any movements on a striker not yet I would say at the moment he still quite a Chelsea still waiting to understand what happens with Christopher kungu injury Chelsea remain optimistic on that but obviously they're still waiting for the situation to be assessed and so to have clarity about the conditions of of Christopher kungu and then they will decide on the striker but again at the moment they feel that is very difficult to find the right option around on the market it's complicated to find Strikers in general and Strikers at Chelsea level so it's not guaranteed that they will sign a striker but they're still exploring options around so let's see we still have two weeks to go if Chelsea choose an older option short term with a bit of experience then maybe they could explore the Saudi Market there's fresh links today for Brito around Karen Benzema and Bobby firmino could either be on Chelsea's raadar or could either Exit somewhere else in January I don't think it's going to be that easy yeah to sign this players Al loan from Saud clubs I'm not sure at all that it's going to be easy especially in the case of of Karim Benzema I know there